Recent Trip to Dealey Plaza

[Alex Hidell]

Take heart- in a recent survey, 75% of Americans said they felt it was a conspiracy.The real question- what the heck can we do about it?

[scottjfkmad]

great post, reading it remind me of my day in dealey plaza in 2009, i did submit to the board then, but if you missed it is all below...the genteleman who was selling, was he a small grey haired man, because that is who was there they day i was in dealey plaza...I wanted to write this for my own personnel account, but on the plane back from Dallas/Forth Worth I decided that I would post it on the board for all to read. If you want to comment, feel free, only nice comments though…Since the age of about 8 I have always been interested in the Kennedy assassination, and then later the Presidency of JFK itself. Like many of my generation my own introduction to it was the 1991 film JFK, but reading more and more lead me away from the Hollywood version to the real version, and a lot of conspiracy theories. Taking note of Jim Garrison, Jim Marrs, Robert Groden and Mark Lane would take me to a new level in which I viewed the Kennedy assassination. Fast forward too 2009, and JFK plays a part in my life on a daily basis, from discussion, to the forum, to buying Kennedy memorabilia off eBay, to working on a Kennedy book I am writing and hope to someday get published even in the smallest of ways.It was Dealey Plaza that I needed to visit; I just needed to see it for myself. You can not be as interested/obsessed with Kennedy Assassination and not go to Dealey Plaza. So after working hard, and saving some cash, I would visit Dealey Plaza in April 2009, only for 1 day as I didn’t want to be there that long to be honest. There was so much I had read and seen about the Plaza, and tried so much to give it a far shake of the whip so to speak, but I just knew I had saved my cash for a trip to Texas that I simply was already convincing myself I wouldn’t enjoy.After landing at Dallas/Forth Worth, I asked the cab driver about Love Field and apparently it is only for smaller, local flights, ie: Forth Worth to Dallas, same route JFK used on November 22nd 1963. The cab driver on the way to the hotel was a nice guy, as we drove down George Bush Highway, he asked why I visited Dallas, and when I mentioned JFK, there seemed a sharp turn in the flow of the conversation, he suddenly turned into Arlen Spector with his magic bullshit story, in which I reminded him of the overwhelming evidence pointing to a gunman from the Knoll, we ended the conversation abruptly and resulted in a low tip for him and a piece of paper with the forums address on, as I pointed out sometimes things are not as black and white as the government likes you to believe. Would be interesting to see know if he ever logged on too the forum. I really couldn’t believe what I was hearing, I had been Dallas, TX for less than 10 minutes and I was already in a fierce conversation about John F.Kennedy, and this was 2009, picture the scene of 1963 if you will. It really did strike me as I have read and seen that a lot down south, even to this day, don’t like JFK. I understand some Dallas citizens, if not Texans, feel that they got a raw deal with there town/state being the source of such a terrible act, but this cab driver wasn’t defending his local area, he was endorsing the Warren Commission, and doing so with a completely straight face, which is worrying by anyone’s account.My hotel was actually in Irving, and I was thinking about Oswald living out there in that small room he rented. It was a weird feeling knowing that he had returned to Irving after the assassination and that I was going to be seeing Dealey Plaza very shortly.Heading to Dealey Plaza, well here I am on a another massive Texas highway heading into downtown Dallas, and my girlfriend is talking all about the sites around me, all I can think of is Nov 22nd 1963. The cab driver and me again don’t exactly see eye to eye on the assassination, in his eyes LBJ saved America when he took the reigns of power that horrible November Day, much to say after a look from my girlfriend my mouth is firmly shut…Why argue with someone who has no idea what he is talking about, and might charge me $1 more too. One argument with a taxi driver is more than enough for me. After walking around downtown Dallas, which if you ask me is very rough. The people seemed friendly, well friendlyish. After walking around for about 5 minutes, I asked an old white man the directions to Dealey Plaza, and he’s face just went to stone. I did feel as if the JFK subject was either a touchy one, or something that some people in Dallas were just not going to accept as a conspiracy. The sense of pure cover up and the mentality of ‘’I’m not going to comment’’ is still very much in the air in Dallas, Texas if you ask me.As I walked into Delaey Plaza, it was literally like walking back in time to November 1963. For obvious reasons nothing in the Plaza has changed since that Friday afternoon. I suddenly felt myself come over in like a trance; something so weird just came over me. I was literally walking around in a daze, reciting were Zapruder had stood, the Moorman picture, and were the Towner family had stood on the corner. For a second or so I actually expected too see the motorcade come down Main onto Elm. This is what happens when you study, and repeatedly study something and then one day you are literally there.All I can say is Jack Kennedy had no chance, literally of getting out of there alive. The Plaza is extremely small, and 3 guns, or however many there was, he had no chance of survival. I have heard and read that the Plaza was small but it was even smaller than I had imagined. As I was standing in the same spot were Mary Moorman was, some idiot guy came up trying to sell us some JFK books, my girlfriend was polite and tried to tell him that her boyfriend probably knew more than him, but it just angered me that some idiot was trying to make $5 off JFK… I know people make a living off the man everyday, but on this day I was in a very emotional place, heck, I was in Dealey Plaza.The whole experience was just eyrie, after taking some pictures I headed over to the Grassy Knoll. Someone had spray painted ‘’911 was an inside job’’ on the back of the grassy knoll. Just simply standing there, looking over the plaza anyone could see that a shot from the front was an obvious possibility, and studying video/photographic evidence easily supports this theory when standing looking out at Dealey Plaza.. People like Alan Dulles, Gerald Ford and obviously my 2 cab drivers didn’t think that people would workout that for a triangulation of crossfire there probably isn’t an area of land in the USA more perfectly laid out than Dealay Plaza.After another 10 minutes or so I wanted to leave, I have waited for nearly 15 years to come to Dallas, TX and Dealey Plaza and I couldn’t wait to leave, which to be honest did really shock me. I always felt I would want to study the Plaza more, but I didn’t. The sheer size of Delay Plaza is what shocked me, it is so dam small. Anyone entering it, is literally close to leaving it at the same time. Dallas was a hostile city in 1963, and you can still sense that today. I just couldn’t bring myself to actually going in the Sixth Floor Museum. I was already emotionally charged, and the site of a certain grey haired changing his mind government salary person may have tipped me over the edge. i:e Gary Mack may have ended up with a smack.Going and seeing the site of the assassination is a must for any JFK Fan, Researcher, and Historian, anyone… I believe the second you walk into Dealey Plaza your in the middle of Nov 22nd 1963 still, everything is so real, as so many witnesses have said, it is like looking at movie that you cant stop. Nothing has changed; you can feel and breathe the sadness of the assassination even today. It really is worth going too see for yourself….

[Dealey Joe]

Great story Scott.I remember my first visit to Dealey.I love going to Oak Cliff to look things over there too.If you really want to get the silent treatment go to Waco and ask where Mt Carmel is

[Alex Hidell]

Many folks are commenting on how small they feel Dealey Plaza looks when they finaly see it in person.While I didn't have this same feeling, it does bring up a good point. The motorcade, by SS mandate, is never to go slower than 40 miles per hour. My calculations show the motorcade, thru the killing zone, was traveling approx 6 miles per hour. Now I realize that after making the tight turn onto Elm from Houston the motorcade had slowed down dramatically but to just go 6 miles per hour thru the killiing zone tells me somehow, someway the driver (Greer) was in on this. He purposefully proceeded at a crawl thru the killing zone. If he had brought the car back up to speed it would have only taken 2-3 seconds to exit the killing zone. That car was driven at 6 mph for a good reason, IMO. To give the shooters every possible chance to get the job done. In fact, just before the fatal head shot, Greer brakes and brings the limo to a near complete stop. He turns around and watches JFK's head explode and then guns it to the hospital. None of Greer's behavior points to his innocence in this. It points to his direct involvement.At least some of the SS (Greer, others?) had to be involved, if just in a peripheral fashion. We've got guys running around Dealey Plaza with fake SS ID's, Greer driving the limo at 6 mph when his instructions are to drive at 40 mph.Too many shady moves by the SS for them to remain blameless. Their behavior can't just be coincidence.

[Mike Ellwood]

While I have no doubt that there was a conspiracy, I have one worry about the triangulation/crossfire theory.How was synchronisation to be achieved? Without it, you would lose the element of surprise and it would not have worked.Going by time-of-day would not have worked, since no one could predict the speed of the motorcade accurately.Reaching a particular spot is a possibility, but then each point of the triangle would have a different perspective on that spot, and it could be misleading. Besides, how would the spot be marked?Walkie-talkies are another possibility. I don't know how reliable they were in 1963, but I think they might have been relatively bulky and hard to conceal. No problem for the men in or on the buildings, but a problem perhaps for the men who were more exposed.Does James Files have anything to say on this aspect of the killing?

[Dealey Joe]

Files said HE and Nicoletti were the only shooters that he was aware of.If there were other shooters he knew nothing about them.I know someone is going to say "umbrella man"I find this hard to believe, what I think is that it was just a person wanting to attract the attention of JFK.I think the idea that there is a conspiracy under every rock is misleadingMultiple shooters were not necessary and would have been foolish. In my opinion if Chuckie had went along with the stand down JFKwould not have been assassinated. At least in Dallas?

[Darcy]

I don't know about "umbrella man" being a shooter, but I just watched a YouTube clip explaining how he could of been a signal.

[Dealey Joe]

Darcy it is possible however I think it was just a guy trying to get the attention of the President and First Lady, you have to admit it would sure work.

[Bob]

Dealey Joe wrote:Darcy it is possible however I think it was just a guy trying to get the attention of the President and First Lady, you have to admit it would sure work.Umbrella Man was sitting next to a man that many of us believe was Orlando Bosch...aka...Walkie Talkie Man. Bosch was communicating to someone in Dealey Plaza. I think that is fairly apparent. Was it to his buddy Luis Posada Carriles, who some believe was on the roof of the Records Building?http://www.jfkmurdersolved.com/posada.htm